Ruthless Roundtable: The Current State of WWE (October 2010)

Cos https://i2.wp.com/cosblog.cosmelentertainment.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/motherbrain.jpg?resize=80%2C84 https://i1.wp.com/cosblog.cosmelentertainment.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/chosen1.gif?resize=49%2C88 https://i0.wp.com/img704.imageshack.us/img704/1368/justicerf.jpg?resize=112%2C86 http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR_Y95fqRgQU-rtPfPkeYJEK0lsxRlRnExl8b_h92K0WMb4USU&t=1&usg=__A28A9nV-wWYg7FMdRSPULbyTgZ8=

This is a special Ruthless Roundtable with a bunch of contributors, including one new contributor and a guest to the blog. As you can see by the icons above that there are five contributors, from left to right we have myself, Cos, Mother Brain, Chosen 1,  the newest contributor’s name (with the Green Lantern symbol) is Justice. And finally, the nameless/faceless icon at the very end will be for guests, we shall call this person Lo!

I did this Roundtable a little different than the previous ones. I sent questions to the following individuals, which I will post below and they all sent their answers in one way or another. The topic for this Roundtable is the Current State of the WWE as of October 2010. These are all individual opinions and once I saw all the answers, while some of us might agree on some things, we definitely don’t agree with everything.

Questions:

What are your thoughts on the potential unification of all the belts?

On that same note, how do you feel about the decision to go with the history of the newer Women’s and Tag Team championships? And why do you think this was chosen?

We all agree, we hate Cena. But we can also all agree that he’s the money maker of the company. Would turning Cena heel help the product? Explain.

Does being in a stable or faction in the WWE hurt your career? (examples being Legacy and Straight Edge Society)

Following that question, do faction even matter to the WWE, outside of Nexus, which stable has gone on to actual success outside of Evolution in recent years (and don’t give me that DX stuff, two people equal a tag team not a faction)?

What is The Hart Dynasty missing? A real leader? They can’t be considered a faction, because there are only two main members who carry belts. And from the looks of things they might be splitting up. Would having another addition to the group help solidify their stance in the company? Perhaps a mid-carder who could win the mid-card belts? (Teddy Hart?)

And finally, what is, in your opinion, the current state of the Tag Team division? And what do you think will happen to Tag Team wrestling?

The following are the answers:

Cos

What are your thoughts on the potential unification of all the belts?

I am not a fan of the potential unification of all the belts. I find that it would limit the storyline potential. I feel as if I’ve covered this previously in another posting (WWE to Unify All of it Championships?) and my feelings are just the same. What would the WWE do with one brand if the champion is in an feud with someone on another. I can clearly remember back in 2002 when the WWE had the Undisputed Championship they couldn’t have the champion feuding with two separate people and confuse the audience. So, they had The Undertaker, at the time the champion, feuding with (possibly Triple H) on Raw and with Tommy Dreamer on Smackdown. I’ll let you decide which one he was going to face.

The same would go for the mid-card championships. There may not be enough people in the tag and women’s division but there are plenty of people to feud in the other divisions. Also, dare I say that they should bring the cruiser weight championship back?

I will say, the only way for a unification of all the belts will help the product would be if they merged the rosters. I mean, with how poor sales have been, perhaps they should merge the rosters and produce the shows the way they did from 1999-2002, I know it was harder to come up with story lines that could lend themselves to two shows a week, but if they can’t sell out because there isn’t enough star power then they need to go back to basics and bring things all together. I’m just saying.

On that same note, how do you feel about the decision to go with the history of the newer Women’s and Tag Team championships? And why do you think this was chosen?

Not a fan of this. I am a purist when it comes to this and it boggles my mind that they wouldn’t want to keep the championships that had such a rich history. So what if the majority of the fan base does not know who those people are, I still don’t know who some of the people in certain tag teams are, or who were some of the Women’s champions. But there was something special about those belts. I have a feeling that they will be back sooner rather than later.

We all agree, we hate Cena. But we can also all agree that he’s the money maker of the company. Would turning Cena heel help the product? Explain.

I don’t know. As much as it would be huge if Cena turned heel. I don’t know if the WWE has the ability to produce this properly. The last time that they had a huge name turn heel (Stone Cold Steve Austin) it was an utter failure. They tend to not know what to do with huge baby faces that turn heel. When The Rock turned heel back in 2003 for his short stint in WWE he wasn’t a full time player. Cena is a full time player and he isn’t really turning the main fan base (the kids) away. In fact they can’t get enough of him. If this was the Attitude Era he would have turned heel by now and back and heel again. But the WWE can’t even let Cena come out in a Nexus t-shirt, for fear of not selling merchandise.

The only way turning Cena heel would work is if they had a young, up and coming, wrestler that they wanted to build up to get a huge win off of Cena to help propel the younger star. Otherwise, allowing someone like Triple H, Randy Orton, or any other current superstar to get a major win over him would make the turn a complete waste.

Does being in a stable or faction in the WWE hurt your career? (examples being Legacy and Straight Edge Society)

https://i2.wp.com/www.todaysfast.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/cm-punk-blessing-the-straight-edge-society-members-wallpapers.jpg?resize=551%2C344


In my opinion, the WWE has not been able to allow a  faction and/or stable to be successful. I know Legacy was pretty huge and Straight Edge Society could have been so much more. But both groups were treated as fodder for one reason or another. Legacy, Randy Orton, Ted DiBiasi and Cody Rhodes, were never able to be as successful as their intended predecessors, Evolution. First they never went pass the three main members. They attempted to add both Manu and Sim Snuka and both failed miserably. Also, DiBiasi and Rhodes were so much better on their own in Priceless then with Legacy. They won two World Tag Team Championships prior to officially joining Legacy, but while in Legacy they were only used to help Orton win or keep his WWE Championship.

As for Straight Edge Society, they could have been such a stronger stable, they were doing pretty good with CM Punk as their leader, Luker Gallows as the second in command and Serena as the lone female member. Then, Joseph Mercury joined and he always seemed like the Crash Holly to Matt Hardy’s Version 1 group with Shanon Moore; he just never truly fit. I also felt that releasing Serena killed the group.

So, who actually benefited from being in these stables? Did the leaders? Punk didn’t really, he got stuck in feuds with Big Show and Rey Mysterio and never got to come out on top of anything. Orton did better by himself especially after he turned face. He may have won a bunch of WWE Championships, but he’s bigger now than before. Even if I don’t like him.

Aside from the obvious, let’s put these people in a group so that they could get some exposure, there hasn’t really been a reason to have stables.

Following that question, do faction even matter to the WWE, outside of Nexus, which stable has gone on to actual success outside of Evolution in recent years (and don’t give me that DX stuff, two people equal a tag team not a faction)?

I think I covered this above. There hasn’t been a successful faction since Evolution. I wish I could include TNA on this, but I don’t remember the last time I saw an LAX, S.E.X. army, Main Event Mafia, The Band, Wolf Pac, Fortune (or any other stable name that they’ve had in their history) T-shirt on a single person…ever!

What is The Hart Dynasty missing? A real leader? They can’t be considered a faction, because there are only two main members who carry belts. And from the looks of things they might be splitting up. Would having another addition to the group help solidify their stance in the company? Perhaps a mid-carder who could win the mid-card belts? (Teddy Hart?)

I feel as if they need another member. A faction usually consists of the leader (main eventer or upper mid carder), tag team champions, and mid carder (and in some cases a women’s division member–see The Right to Censor). The Hart Dynasty has two of these, the tag team and women’s divisions. One could also say that both Tyson Kidd and David Hart Smith could be mid card champions. But I doubt that we’ll even get to see that. I’ll bet you that they’ll get them back in the tag team division and just let them stay there, either winning or just loosing. Doesn’t matter. That’s why they have WWE Superstars on Thursdays.

As for Teddy Hart, I heard that he’s had WWE developmental deals, but he can’t stay focused enough. In fact a year before The Hart Dynasty debuted, they were supposed to come out (I want to say in the fall) with Teddy Hart, Natalya and DH Smith; Smith had a run in with drugs and Teddy Hart was released and now we are stuck with it’s current incarnation.

I would hate to see them get rid of The Hart Dynasty, but in order to give the Hart name a little more leverage, another name needs to be added to the list.

And finally, what is, in your opinion, the current state of the Tag Team division? And what do you think will happen to Tag Team wrestling?

It’s a shame that the tag team division isn’t as strong as it was a little under a decade ago. I can remember how the WWE used to be such a well oiled machine and every match was worth watching. Now, things just seemed rushed and thrown together. It’s shocking to me how every actual tag team that they have they tend to split for one reason or another. Like they needed to split The Colons or Cryme Tyme. I was hoping that The Dudley Boyz would come back to WWE and re-ignite the tag division, but last I checked they’ve resigned with TNA.

Here is hoping something happens soon with the tag division. I haven’t actually cared about a tag match in so long.


https://i2.wp.com/cosblog.cosmelentertainment.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/motherbrain.jpg?resize=80%2C84

The State of the WWE
By Mother Brain

What are your thoughts on the potential unification of all the belts?

I think this was inevitable for quite a few years now. They realized following the brand-only debacle of ECW December to Dismember 2006 that they’re better off co-branding the rosters on every PPV than keeping them separate. It’s been a very slow progression between then and now. But the fact is most belts lost their prestige due to lack of title defenses (i.e. Miz with the U.S. Title), lack of competition (Tag Team Titles), or quite simple a change in the company’s direction (Retiring the Women’s Title in favor of the Diva’s title). Give it a couple more years and you’ll see the brands ultimately merge.

On that same note, how do you feel about the decision to go with the history of the newer Women’s and Tag Team championships? And why do you think this was chosen?

https://i0.wp.com/www.wwedivas4u.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Lay-Cool-is-still-women-Champion.jpg?resize=373%2C287


Retiring the Women’s Title was something I’m very comfortable with. As I mentioned in one of my earlier blogs, there’s only 5 real women wrestlers employed with WWE right now and the rest of them are models/aspiring actresses who are getting by with basic training. In other words, product divas Kelly Kelly and the Bella Twins do not compare to the caliber of Wendi Richter, Fabulous Moolah, and Trish Stratus. The women today are simply “divas” and not “competitors”.

As for the Tag Team Titles, I always thought it made no sense to have two belts in the first place. I assume the rebooting of the title history was done due to the state of the tag team division being so lacking right now. But lets not forget 1996 when all they had were the Godwins and the Smoking Gunns. All it takes are just a handful of teams to reignite the division as in 1999 with the Hardys, Dudley Boyz, and Edge and Christian.

We all agree, we hate Cena. But we can also all agree that he’s the money maker of the company. Would turning Cena heel help the product? Explain.

When Stone Cold Steve Austin got over in 1996, it marked a shift in the wrestling audience from cheering the “super hero” to cheering the “anti-hero”. As a result, Bret Hart had to turn heel for the company to move into a new direction. The PG rating in 2007 reversed that trend due to John Cena’s popularity with women and kids. It is true that Cena draws money on merchandise sales; however, if he’s supposed to be this generation’s Hogan, Austin, or Rock, then why are his movies flopping at the box office? Why isn’t WWE as popular as it was 10 years ago?

One thing you have to remember is that Shawn Michaels had the exact same run in 1996 as champion with the dominance over major heels and selling tons of merchandise. But WWE was on the losing end of the Monday Night War with WCW and there was nothing babyface HBK could do to turn the tide…. not until the birth of DX. Basically Cena has run his course as a top babyface and you know it just by how stale his promos and storylines are, resulting in low ratings and PPV buys. Time to take a new direction, Vince.

Does being in a stable or faction in the WWE hurt your career? (examples being Legacy and Straight Edge Society)

Stables help in terms of visibility. Randy Orton and Batista never got attention until they joined Evolution and got rubs off Triple H and Ric Flair. But I don’t think they necessarily help or hurt one’s career. Remember Hercules when he was part of the Heenan Family? God rest his soul. Yet unfortunately, he didn’t elicit a reaction from the crowd whether he was in a stable or acting on his own.

Following that question, do faction even matter to the WWE, outside of Nexus, which stable has gone on to actual success outside of Evolution in recent years (and don’t give me that DX stuff, two people equal a tag team not a faction)?

I don’t think there are many factions that lead to success aside from Evolution. Every faction I can think of (Hart Foundation, Heenan Family, Nation of Domination, Million Dollar Corporation, Los Boriquas, Radicalz, etc) had one or two breakout stars but the others would flounder and go off to another company or have their lives end in tragedy (Pillman, Owen, Davey Boy Smith, and so -on).

What is The Hart Dynasty missing? A real leader? They can’t be considered a faction, because there are only two main members who carry belts. And from the looks of things they might be splitting up. Would having another addition to the group help solidify their stance in the company? Perhaps a mid-carder who could win the mid-card belts? (Teddy Hart?)

Bret Hart made an honest point in his first DVD when he said that Jim Neidhart carried the Hart Foundation because of his colorful personality which translated well in interviews. Tyson Kidd and David Hart Smith have a tremendous amount of talent; however, they don’t have the mic skills or unique personalities (Neidhart the tough guy comedian of the Hart Foundation, Bret the straight-shooting speed and skill of the Hart Foundation) to resonate with fans. Teddy Hart could help add more energy to the matches. But a mouthpiece is what’s more important.

And finally, what is, in your opinion, the current state of the Tag Team division? And what do you think will happen to Tag Team wrestling?

Too many teams are consisting of guys who are being thrown together and lacking chemistry. Perhaps the company is trying to find the same level of success they had with the New Age Outlaws where Billy Gunn and Road Dogg were such an odd paring. The titles have become less important and the matches are not as fun and colorful as the days of the Harts, Legion of Doom, Demolition, and the Rockers among others. I doubt it will go away but as I said before, it only takes a handful of teams to reignite the division.

https://i1.wp.com/cosblog.cosmelentertainment.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/chosen1.gif?resize=49%2C88

1. I feel that if WWE unifies all the titles they would then be forced to unify the separate brands. There are just certain guys that you know would not be up for working both Monday and Tuesday nights and it would hurt a lot of the house shows.  Even though we all know the chances of a title changing hands at a house show are slim to none if there is no title match the chances are ZERO. This could hurt the already low ticket sales for house shows. The last house show I went to had Cena and Jericho in a cage and was AMAZING. It was better then a lot of the matches I have seen at Pay Per Views. They booked it so well that I felt the whole match that there was a chance Jericho was going to steal the title.  If they unify the titles the champ isn’t going to be at all the house shows that they could be at while having separate brands and separate champions. I think its safe to say that I believe as long as there are separate brands there should be separate branded titles. This brings me to the titles that they have recently unified. The Women’s title or Diva’s title and the World Tag Team Titles have become and after thought to many in my opinion. Even good female matches (Melina, Beth Phoenix, and a few that are no longer with the company Trish and Mickie James) you can count on there being 2 or 3 botched moves. And with the departures of some of the top female performers the matches are just not as entertaining as they used to be. Ugh I just admitted that there have been good female wrestling matches. The WWE seems set on their females all being Divas not Wrestlers. So in order to kind of make that shift they went with that as their Female championship. As for the shift in the Unified Tag Team Titles… I don’t even know what to think with this one. Maybe the WWE has just simply doesn’t care and it simply won the coin toss as Stephanie went with the “Tails never fails” approach. But honestly how can you even have a Tag Team Championship when there are only what 2 actual tag teams that aren’t just oh lets throw this guy with that guy and call them a combination of their names the fans will love it. I know you all hate how much I enjoy TNA but TNA has legit tag teams and legit women’s division. Sorry had to sneak that in there 🙂

https://i2.wp.com/fast1.onesite.com/fans.wwe.com/user/wwesmackdownfan/belts_2.jpg?resize=400%2C300

2. I HATE CENA 🙂 Face Cena sucks Heel Cena would suck just as much. Unfortunately the WWE is PGing its product to the max the kids love him. Turning him heel would break the hearts of the whole Cena Nation. That said in 1996 my childhood hero turned in his red and yellow for black and white and the ratings went through the roof. I just dont see the wwe risking all those cena nation sales with a full heel turn.

3. A good faction can make your career a bad faction can turn you into “The Oddities” I think through the years factions have been a great stepping stone for many wrestlers. But is it the faction that makes the wrestler better or the wrestler that makes the faction better.  In order to have a successful faction everybody in the faction must know its place. Who the leader is and who the “cronies” are. With the egos in professional wrestling this doesn’t always work out well. And lets face it if you don’t have tag-teams in wrestling how do you expect to have successful factions. I cant think of a top faction in history of wrestling that didn’t have a tag team. The original and in my opinion the best 4 Horseman had Arn and Ole Anderson and then Arn Anderson and Tully Blanchard. The original DX had the New Age Outlaws. The NWO had the Outsiders. Even Evolution had Flair and Batista (not the greatest tag team but still successful). So how can there be a faction that is able to maintain success when there is no tag-team that stays together for any extended period of time. The Hart Dynasty needs a singles wrestler who can compete for IC and/or United States belts and a super stud that can get a world title push. Teddy Hart could be given the shot at the “lower level” belts. That still leaves the opening for a world champion in the fold. As i began to think about this why wouldnt they be able to bring in simply somebody who had been trained in the Hart Family Dungeon ie. Jericho… I know its not gonna happen but if we want the Hart Dynasty to be legit who better then Jericho to put them up there…I think that the Nexus was a dumb idea from the start. The second season of NXT had better wrestlers in my opinion and the only one that gets to be on TV anymore is Low-Ki (Kaval). Yet we are still having Wendy’s for dinner on Monday Night (Sorry Heath Slater)

https://i0.wp.com/img704.imageshack.us/img704/1368/justicerf.jpg?resize=112%2C86

I hate the idea of unifying the titles. I feel it takes away from a lot of the current crop of main
event talent that aren’e even in the title picture. Guys like CM Punk, Jack Swagger, the Big Show
and Edge are being overlooked and there are 2 World Champions as of now. By unifying the titles, too
many guys will be lost in the shuffle. Plus, if the world champion is feuding with a RAW superstar,
what is going to make me tune into Smackdown?

As far as the idea of unifying the world Tag Team and Diva’s champonships, I do agree with this idea
with the state of the current tag team and women’s division. There are only a few “real” tag teams in
the WWE as of now so the idea one set of tag team chmpions makes sense. Same goes for the women’s
division. But the idea of taking away the history that was built buy the previous holders of those
titles would anger me if I was a performer. I mean, if i’m Cody Rhodes, I could sit down on my hotel
bed and look at my ugly new tag team belt and think “these belts have been held by the likes of Hulk
Hogan, the Hart Foundation, L.O.D., New Age Outlaws and Shawn Michaels & Stone Cold Steve Austin”. But
now he can think “These belts have been held by Los Gurrerros, Edge and Mysterio and the Hart Dynasty”.
Yeah, there goes tag team wrestling history right down the drain. Taking nothing away from those three
tag team, they won’t ever have make the top 50 greatest tag teams in the history of wrestling list. By
taking away history, you take away crediblilty in my opinion.

Turning John Cena heel now would be a big mistake. let’s face it, John Cena is the WWE. We can say all
we want about him but he’s the face of the company. The problem is, where does Cena go after feuding
with Nexus? Where he should go is Smackdown. Keep him a face for now. He’s feuded with everyone on RAW,
face or heel. If he does turn heel who does he feud with? Orton again? John Morrison? R-Truth? Evan
Bourne? I don’t want to see any of that. But as a face on Smackdown he has the oppertunity to feud with
Jack Swagger, CM Punk and Kane who Cena has never really done big business with. Plus he can start a
program with the Undertaker leading to the WWE Wrestlemania dream match between the two (author’s side-
note: If Cena ends the Undertaker’s Wrestlemania streak, this whole blog becomes irrelevant because I
will never watch Wrestling again). And could you imagine how great it would be if RAW wins a match on
the draft day and Cena comes back and turns heel? I’m watching that and waiting with anticipation for
next week’s show. Plus the WWE wants to keep the NXT show going so by putting Cena on Syfy, that gives
Smackdown better raitings and Syfy may let the WWE bring NXT back to the network.

https://i1.wp.com/www.psd-dreams.de/data/thumbnails/2261/John_Cena_16.jpg?resize=230%2C230

Historically, being in a stable in the WWE leads you nowhere. With a few notable exceptions (Evolution,
the Hart Foundation circa 1995 and Legacy) who wasn’t been the leader of a faction and went on to become
a main eventer? Curt Hawkins and Zack Ryder? D-Lo Brown, Mark Henry and the Godfather? The DOA? Los
Boriquas? X-Pac, Road Dogg and Billy Gunn? do you see Luke Gallows or Joseph Mercury main-eventing a WWE
pay-per-view in the near future? I don’t. Even with Legacy, Cody Rhodes and Ted DiBiase got push while
Manu and Sim Snuka got fired. Stables don’t enhance careers, they give mid-carders something to do.

The only faction in my memory to produce multiple World Champions in recent memory is the nWo, a WCW
stable. The WWE hasn’t has one i don’t believe ever. The Naton of Domination only had the Rock, DX had
Triple H, Legacy had Randy Orton. The only sucessful faction in recent memory there has been in the WWE
has been Legacy. All three members have gotten a significant push after the split. Do I miss the days of
the DOA vs Los Boriquas and DX vs the Nation of Domination? Sure. Gang-like warfare was always great to
see. But it doesn’t lead the actual wrestlers to get a better stance in the company.

The Hart Dynasty is done. There going to split, DH Smith will become the heel, Tyson Kidd will become
tag-team partners with Evan Bourne or Justin Gabriel after the Nexus splits and no onw will care about
either unless Bret Hart calls Triple H and tells him to push them. There is no saving grace. Teddy Hart
is a headcase and won’t work in the WWE. There is no Dynasty anymore. Just another failed attempt at
resurecting an old idea.

Tag Team wrestling is alive and well in TNA. Beer Money, MCMG, Generation ME, Ink Inc, Team 3D, London
Brawling are great tag teams. The WWE counters TNA with the Uso’s, the soon to be broken up Hart
Dynasty, Vladamir Kozlov and Santino Marella and the current champions, Cody Rhodes and Drew McIntyre.
Oh how the Mighty WWE has fallen. Remember the Hardy Boyz? Too Cool? The Dudleys? Edge and Christian?
MNM? Los Gurrerros? The New Age Outlaws? Miz & Morrison? Even Billy and Chuck? REAL TAG TEAMS! The WWE
Tag team division sucks mightly due to Vince concentrating on Singles wrestling. In My opinion, say
good-bye to tag team wrestling in the WWE because if it lasts, it won’t be good for a while. I’m still
shocked the Nexus hasn’t won the belts yet. At least they can do the Spirit Squad gimmick with them and
have them all defend it. Coming from a big fan of tag team wrestling, I’ll stick to TNA.

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR_Y95fqRgQU-rtPfPkeYJEK0lsxRlRnExl8b_h92K0WMb4USU&t=1&usg=__A28A9nV-wWYg7FMdRSPULbyTgZ8=

1. Interesting, but not a fan of it, because it just showing there’s no competition and there not building up anybody and have nothing new to do.

2. they just wanted something new to do, again there not much competition if they’re going to be on both show, especially the not much existing ”tag team division,.. Also those tag team belts look like over sized pennies i call them the penny belts lol

3. it just might, possibly lose money, because all the kids would be upset, but my friends would LOVE to see him turn heel, in a way I do too, I would wish he would be like he used to, being a rapper,..but the people who hate cena, would probably like him if he turned heel.

4. No, I don’t think so, it helps peoples career, remember evolution and randy orton?

5. factions just make the product interesting, but succeess wise, not many becuase you listed them already lol oh wait . oh, the ministy,.

6. ill agree! adding somone would be better, teddy hart.

7. to be real honest, I think the tag team division is garbage, there not many tag teams out there, it just seems there taking random guys and putting them together and seeing if it works..ex cody rhodes and drew. the future of tag team…itll just be the same, the belts will go on both shows.

https://i1.wp.com/s.bebo.com/app-image/7928150522/5411656627/PROFILE/i.quizzaz.com/img/q/u/08/04/13/morrison_and_the_miz.jpg?w=747

final thoughts..why can’t the show superstars be on a normal channel that everyone can get? i dont have WGN 🙁 they get more rating if they went to a normal station, then again it seems like all their shows is going to syfy lol

Leave a Reply